Daveg
NT & VTS Council member
I believe I am perfect, but others may differ in opinion?
Posts: 1,549
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Post by Daveg on Feb 25, 2012 15:27:12 GMT
You guys/girls might of already come across this problem, but this is a firt for me I have just tested a Mitsubishi carisma yesterday and when I had driven the car into the test bay, I did as always the pre-checks and then registered the vehicle for test. I did my normal routine, which is slightly different than the testers manual layout, in that I don't initially start my inspection off in the drivers seat, however when I got to that part of the inspection I depressed the foot brake a couple of times and held sustained pressure without the engine running, nothing too excessive when depressing the pedal, then without warning the pedal went to the floor, i.e. no reserve travel. At this point I knew something had failed and was depressed, the reason being that I knew that I was now doing a full mot test knowing that I would have to abandon the test at the end, what an absolute waist of time and effort. Anyway, I found during the underside inspection that the nearside front brake hose where it is secured to the suspension leg had leaked. On closer inspection it appears that the hoses are being forced to bend around an angle which seriously impeads the fluid flow through the hose, when on full steering lock, and is causing unnecessary strain resulting in damage by forcing the hose to cut into the ferrule, which is secured to the suspension leg. I will photograph it Monday and upload it. We have today changed both front hoses and carried out another full mot test. This is another sore point really, if a vehicle does not leave the VTS for a defect of this nature,where the test is fully completed except for parts of the test that can't be tested, why can't the vehicle being issued with a fail notification and then have all necessary items checked at retest just like a normal retest? It seems absolutely unjustifed for an mot tester to test a vehicle and then have to carryout another full test to that same vehicle within an hour or so after changing brake hoses or pipes, where a roller brake test is carried out to check the results of repairs and then another full test to be done, checking everything that has not relevance to the parts that could not be inspected? Somebody needs to think about this in VOSA properly! Dave
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alex
Nominated Tester
Posts: 305
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Post by alex on Feb 25, 2012 20:40:12 GMT
Well said daveg why go to all that bother you've tested the car start to finish then have to abandon test repair the damn thing then carry out another ful test seems a complete waste of time considering we,ve already carried out most of the test initially,those front hoses are quite alarming failed loads of them also on Volvo v40,s spring on hose cuts through on the bend and not always easily spotted as well BMW 1 series front hoses finding quite a common failure because of the way the hose is shaped/bends.
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Post by flashgordon1 on Feb 25, 2012 20:53:43 GMT
Fiat puntos are prone to front fleixs collapsing and causing a front brake bind..........
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phaetonott
Nominated Tester
I may not be right but at least I am trying!
Posts: 376
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Post by phaetonott on Feb 25, 2012 21:15:04 GMT
Somebody needs to think about this in VOSA properly! Dave Now Dave, do you really think that's going to happen? Almost as stupid, I did a 97 Megane yesterday which had a cracked cat. It failed on lambda, outside the parameters of my analyser. Why the hell can't I simply fail the emissions without going through a specific vehicle test if its bleeding obvious it's never going to pass. Three minutes at 2750 rpm didn't change the readings but left me with a cat glowing cherry red! I've got better things to do than scrabble around in thick grease and crap looking for an engine code on an engine that's already pretty hot and then stand there under the disapproving gaze of the presenter while you waste his petrol.
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Post by EcoTrans (Leicester) on Aug 12, 2012 17:53:21 GMT
You guys/girls might of already come across this problem, but this is a firt for me I have just tested a Mitsubishi carisma yesterday and when I had driven the car into the test bay, I did as always the pre-checks and then registered the vehicle for test. I did my normal routine, which is slightly different than the testers manual layout, in that I don't initially start my inspection off in the drivers seat, however when I got to that part of the inspection I depressed the foot brake a couple of times and held sustained pressure without the engine running, nothing too excessive when depressing the pedal, then without warning the pedal went to the floor, i.e. no reserve travel. At this point I knew something had failed and was depressed, the reason being that I knew that I was now doing a full mot test knowing that I would have to abandon the test at the end, what an absolute waist of time and effort. Anyway, I found during the underside inspection that the nearside front brake hose where it is secured to the suspension leg had leaked. On closer inspection it appears that the hoses are being forced to bend around an angle which seriously impeads the fluid flow through the hose, when on full steering lock, and is causing unnecessary strain resulting in damage by forcing the hose to cut into the ferrule, which is secured to the suspension leg. I will photograph it Monday and upload it. We have today changed both front hoses and carried out another full mot test. This is another sore point really, if a vehicle does not leave the VTS for a defect of this nature,where the test is fully completed except for parts of the test that can't be tested, why can't the vehicle being issued with a fail notification and then have all necessary items checked at retest just like a normal retest? It seems absolutely unjustifed for an mot tester to test a vehicle and then have to carryout another full test to that same vehicle within an hour or so after changing brake hoses or pipes, where a roller brake test is carried out to check the results of repairs and then another full test to be done, checking everything that has not relevance to the parts that could not be inspected? Somebody needs to think about this in VOSA properly! Dave Had my first Charisma hose burst last week, right by the metal, looked very reasonable tho' and just goes to show how careful we need to be. Our RBT is at the start of the test, but it might be an idea for those that have never had this sort of 'abandon' failure & whose brake test comes at the end, to give a seriously firm press of the pedal during the pre-test checks. In fact, that might be a good idea for all tests regardless. Fortnight ago i had an X5 burst it's nearside rear pipe (corrosion) during the RBT. Someone further back in the thread notes the old Volvo V40 (S40 is the same) and they are bang on! But sometimes this very localised perrishing of the flexi can ONLY be seen when viewed from underneath, full lock, and then gently tweaking the hose to reveal. Scary stuff!
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Daveg
NT & VTS Council member
I believe I am perfect, but others may differ in opinion?
Posts: 1,549
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Post by Daveg on Aug 12, 2012 20:32:03 GMT
All in ALL it does need bringing up an the Council Meeting for discussion as I am reasonably confident VOSA will not have this sort of experience. Daveg
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Post by baz657 on Aug 13, 2012 12:02:28 GMT
Why wait until November? Contact them now with evidence. Enquiries@vosa.gov.ukor National Number - Tel: 0300 123 9000 or Berkeley House, Croydon Street, Bristol BS5 0DA Fax: 0117 9543212
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Post by David on Aug 13, 2012 13:17:21 GMT
I reckon he knows the contact number Baz
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Post by David on Aug 13, 2012 13:18:27 GMT
.....you could always use the "Items not tested" option
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Post by EcoTrans (Leicester) on Aug 13, 2012 19:48:13 GMT
I've saved my X5 hoses (pipes) (previous posting/s). Scariest burst through corrosion I ever saw, which I am going to post to Stevo. I am not big enough to change anything on my own.
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Post by spotty on Aug 14, 2012 6:42:52 GMT
I was coming to end of my underside checks on a colleagues Mondeo, I had looked at the brake pipes which didn't really give me cause for concern and was doing a pressure check with an assistant in the car. To my surprise a brake pipe, out of sight above the fuel tank burst.
I carried on with the test and it retained enough fluid so that I could complete the test.
I had a Nissan that developed a new leak at the front caliper to hose joint and recently a MK 2 Octavia that had a leak at the ABS block.
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Post by aylesburyjock on Aug 14, 2012 15:08:45 GMT
Regardless of where your brake rollers are sited, you would be advised to save your rbt till the end, so you have a good idea what sort of condition the pipes and hoses are in.
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phaetonott
Nominated Tester
I may not be right but at least I am trying!
Posts: 376
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Post by phaetonott on Aug 14, 2012 19:44:57 GMT
True Jock, VE visited my previous employer and watched me do a test, and strongly advised me to do the roller test last. Didn't stop me bursting a pipe on a 52plate Focus a few days later, Pipe above tank totally out of sight .
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Post by aylesburyjock on Aug 15, 2012 15:25:14 GMT
Yep. You can only test what you can see.
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